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RustyCas

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Reply with quote  #1 

I’ve always just had an hourly rate which includes my time and equipment, whether I’m balancing, aligning, or doing vibration analysis - client pays by the hour, no matter how much equipment I pull out.

Now suppose I purchase a $30K motion amplification system. I might pull that out as an “initial” step, prior to doing the usual vibration analysis.  Or perhaps I would use it as a confirming step afterwards. I can’t imagine anyone using just MA to analyze a problem without also collecting normal vibration data, but is that done? Is my thinking on this archaic in the modern technology-centric world?

My main question is, do I charge an additional fee for this really nice visualization tool if I was not hired to do an MA study? Even if it wasn’t requested by the customer, they are going to gain from having a visualization of the data collected and the analysis I’ve done. I don’t think I’d necessarily ask about this before using it, because one of the advertised benefits is how “quick and easy” it is (or at least that’s what I “hear” them saying). To be clear, I think of MA is a really nice, but not necessary, tool.

Interested in hearing from other consultants, as well as those of you who might hire them.


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vogel

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Reply with quote  #2 
Many service companies our there have different rates depending on the complexity of the job. For instance, the hourly rate for fluid-film bearing analysis with a zonicbook/Adre or a modal test may double the hourly rate of route data collection.
So, yes, I would increase the price for MA testing. Or I'd keep the hourly rate the same and I'd charge for the equipment.
 
electricpete

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Reply with quote  #3 
if it shows up as a separate line item on the bill and the customer didn't ask for it, that might bother them.
RHW2ND

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Reply with quote  #4 
I agree,
We provide flir pictures as a part of our route predictive maintenance program. Considering the time of collection being reduced and the fact that a lot of our clients have these lower priced thermographic pictures. ( by the way I started with thermographic surveys with our vibration program for Americam Bureau of Shipping non destructive surveys in the late 1970's with a Polaroid Land Camera for Industrial Analysis Corporation).

I'm thinking that as we are called out on new jobs other than our regular PMP clients we will charge more for motion analysis and thermography
ckyjohn

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Reply with quote  #5 
Typical is an hourly rate as well as a daily equipment rate added in to cover the cost of equipment. This is put forth in the proposal stage so the customer is aware and agrees. We need to cover the cost of equipment as well as our time. Alternately, you could have different rates for vibration analysis and motion amplification work in a service rate sheet which would spread the equipment rate over an 8 hour period. I believe the equipment rate looks better to customers however.

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Big Al

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Reply with quote  #6 
I had three quotes in the UK this year for service providers to come on site and carry out motion amplification.

This was a full day rate for just motion amplification and nothing else. I'd say that two of them were charging roughly double their normal VA day rate and one of them was charging a whopping 5x.

You've got to get that return on investment somewhere.
RustyCas

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Reply with quote  #7 
Al, what exactly do you get with “MA and nothing else”? Do you get a written report or just a video? Does it include spectra?

When I do a report, I always include enough data (plots - spectra, TWF, trends, transient, etc) to justify my conclusion. Trying to imagine what a MA “report” looks like.

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Danny Harvey

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Reply with quote  #8 
"When I do a report, I always include enough data (plots - spectra, TWF, trends, transient, etc) to justify my conclusion."

So do I, but very few actually look at the data I include. Maybe if it's a picture or a video, they will look. But if it's a spectrum/twf/trend that, to us screams "BAD BEARING. CHANGE NOW" they likely are not interested in anything more than the latter part of the scream. I do it anyway because I believe that we should be able to support our calls with data.

If you left a MA camera in the truck and used it after your route then it would be easier to separate the charges. (But it also might mean a long walk after a long route.) One for the use of the camera (maybe a flat fee) and one for your time.  And your client would likely be happy to pay extra for the service without having to pay a full day minimum on both the tech and the camera if he were to call someone in. He would get the service for the fee of maybe $200 plus your additional time for recording, analysis and reporting. So for maybe $500-$700 he gets his answer the same day.

Sounds like a good deal for him to me but I'm just guessing at what would be a proper fee. You'd need to use it a lot at that.
Big Al

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Reply with quote  #9 
Rusty,

Obviously I picked one of the cheaper quotes. Site management were keen to trial the technology, so it was used on a machine on which I'd already diagnosed a fault with VA. And yes, it confirmed the fault.

All I received was the videos. If I'd wanted a full report, then that was an extra cost.

The company that were charging the highest rate included a bump test so that high amplitudes could be compared to natural frequencies, spectra and a full report.
Shoveldr

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Reply with quote  #10 
Rusty,

I don't do MA, but I have friends who do.  Its not a matter of pointing a camera and seeing the amplified motion.  The high res video is recorded, post processed, and then reviewed and manipulated.  He says is great when you have a limited amount of time to access the equipment, but it can take him a day for analysis and reporting.  

I see MA as a diagnostic tool, its not yet at the point where it can replace routes and trending, I would offer it as an option with an associated added cost.  People will see value in it as they can understand the video a lot better than all the squiggly lines.

Rich

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